Act’s arts spokesman once watched a musical

It took Act’s arts spokesman Todd Stephenson 20 minutes to think of a single New Zealand author and a single New Zealand book. The only artistic experience he could think of is that he went to see Hamilton in New York. His only press release on the arts has been to issue an empty threat about funding cuts to Creative New Zealand because he was upset Tusiata Avia was awarded the Prime Minister’s Award for Poetry. His central philosophy about government arts funding is the less, the better; he doubted that the majority of New Zealanders want their tax dollar spent on the arts. And yet Stephenson likely earns the basic MP salary, paid for by the taxpayer, of $163,000, in return for a paltry 2807 votes in the Southland electorate.

Thanks for taking the time. Where do I find you? Are you in an office or something?

I’ve just got to my apartment, so I’m fine.

So, Todd, I know really very little about you. Southland born and raised. Worked in the pharmaceutical industry and lived in Sydney for 17 years, and now in Queenstown with a partner called Alex. Your hobbies include hiking. Why are you Act spokesman for arts?

Actually it was a portfolio I asked for. I think arts and culture is important to a society. And when we were talking about who would be different spokespeople on different topics, I said I was quite interested in doing that.

What’s your experience or knowledge of the arts?

I’m going to say, other than as a consumer, very limited. There’s some parts of the art sector I’m personally interested in, but, yeah, it’s an area I’m wanting to learn more about. And I’m slowly getting to know.

What parts are you interested in?

Personally, along with my partner, I quite like musicals, so that’s probably something we would go to when we have the opportunity.

What musicals have you attended?

I haven’t for a little while, Steve, to be honest. But I think the last one I went to was Hamilton. I saw it in New York.

I’m conducting the interview in my hat as the literary editor of the books section at Newsroom. So what about literature? What’s your experience or knowledge there?

I’m going to be pretty straight up with you, Steve. I mainly read nonfiction, to be honest. So it’s been a while since I’ve read a novel. I’m going to admit that.

What’s your nonfiction taste?

Well, the last one I actually read was about the Labor victory in Australia. I read a lot of kind of political biographies and I’m obviously interested in campaigns.

What about New Zealand books?

That’s an area I want to kind of learn a bit more about. It’s something I’m hoping to develop as part of being arts spokesman. I haven’t actually got into talking to anyone from the literature community yet, but that’s on my list of areas I want to kind of get to know a bit more as I get into this portfolio.

Are there any New Zealand authors who you’ve read?

It’s been a long time, to be honest, Steve. I’m just trying to think of the last one I would have have read. Can I come back to you on that? I’ll give that some thought as we’re talking.

No one’s coming to mind? Not a single New Zealand author?

Not immediately. Let me come back to you.

Well, this goes to why I’m a little bit mystified as to why you’ve chosen this spokesman role when your knowledge of the arts seems to be just about zero to negligible.

Well, look, Steve, that’s part of why I want to start to get around stakeholders. I’ve talked to a prominent New Zealand actor. I’ve talked to a screenwriter. I’m going to be speaking to a movie director shortly. And I’m actually getting out to a meeting with a creative centre in Queenstown later this week.

So I want to start to get around the community and find out a bit more about what they see as the issues and what they think government should or shouldn’t be doing.

How have your talks gone so far? What sort of issues have been traversed?

The kind of issues so far have been about just the way the different parts of the sector are supported by government. So getting a better understanding of that, seeing whether there is a gap for, I suppose, emerging talent, are they getting enough support.

What’s your philosophy about government support of the arts?

I think that arts and creative sector is very important to the culture of society, but I want to see that supported by individuals and, you know, very much not have the government involved. We want to ensure people have more of their own money to spend on things that they value and want to support. We see the same thing in the arts and creative sector.

So government funding of, say, literature, how do you feel about that? Would you rather it be done privately?

Absolutely. I want people to support things that they value and want to either purchase or go and see.

But that money isn’t forthcoming. That’s one of the reasons why there is government funding of the arts.

And that’s why we want to actually build a more prosperous New Zealand. You know, actually help people get high paid jobs, keep more of their money and allow them to actually invest in things that they think are important, including the arts sector.

You’ll know, I’m sure, the experience in other developed countries where philanthropy of the arts is actually a far greater percentage of funding than in New Zealand.

Are you aware of the Australian government model for arts funding, which is extremely progressive, very generous, and the envy of New Zealand arts practitioners?

No. I haven’t looked at what they’ve done in Australia.

Do you have sort of an optimum figure of what could be government funding for, say, literature? Because there would be a lot of literary activity, publishing, etcetera, which would wither on the vine if it wasn’t for government funding.

Well, as I said, you know, where Act approaches these things, we want to allow people to keep more of their money. So obviously we’re into reducing taxes and then allowing individuals to actually purchase and invest in things they see as value, including in the arts and buying literature and books. That would be one of those things we would very much encourage.

That’s a total fantasy.

Well, one of the issues as I see it with what the government currently is doing is that some of these bodies like Creative New Zealand are funding things that maybe New Zealanders aren’t interested in or wouldn’t value. And so we’ve got to say, well, “How many people do those agencies actually represent?” How could they actually, Steve, represent over four million New Zealanders in their tastes? So isn’t it better to allow individuals to choose what they support and what they value?

So far your only press release statement on anything to do with the arts has been your condemnation of CNZ giving the Prime Minister’s Award for Poetry to Tusiata Avia, which you object to because of her poem about James Cook.

Yes, obviously, you know, I’m a very strong free speech advocate but in that particular case, while she has the right to write what she wants, is Creative New Zealand supporting her something that most New Zealanders would see of value? We’ve got to really ask ourselves, you know, how can an agency like that actually represent, uh, the diverse, uh, I suppose, views and what different New Zealanders would value and, you know, is it appropriate for them to be spending money on things like that.

Are you aware of the body of her work?

I’ve read some of it.

You’ve read one poem, haven’t you.

I’ve read a couple actually. But yeah, it’s not something I would spend my time reading to be honest.

You wrote in that press statement about Tusiata, “With the new government looking to make spending cuts at low value departments, Creative New Zealand is tempting fate.” Can you expand on that?

From Act’s perspective, we’re really saying, you know, are the individuals in these organisations representing what the majority of New Zealanders would want to see supported? I don’t think that they can do that.

You know, people have very individual tastes. And so it’s better that individuals make those decisions rather than, I suppose, you know, a bureaucratic agency imposing their choices on New Zealanders.

But you don’t have individual tastes yourself, do you? You’re kind of an arts ignoramus, really, by your own reckoning.

No, I certainly have individual things that I like to go to. We talked about that earlier.

You’ve been to see Hamilton.

Well, I was just giving you an example of the things I like to do.

What are your tastes, other than musicals?

That’s the main one in the creative sector.

Musicals.

And I watch movies. I watch TV.

“I watch TV,” says the Act spokesman for the arts.

Creative things are on TV, are they not, Steve?

Any New Zealand authors come to mind yet? Any? While the interview has progressed, I thought maybe one might have occurred to you.

Well, Alan Duff is probably the last one I would have read.

What book of his did you read?

Everyone has read Once Were Warriors.

Did you read it? Or did you just see the movie?

No, I read it a while ago.

So that’s it. The only New Zealand book you can think of is Once Were Warriors, published in 1985.

I mean, I’m being honest with you, Steve, it’s a portfolio I’m wanting to learn more about. But what are you hoping I will learn from this portfolio? As the literary editor of Newsroom, what are you hoping I will learn from understanding more about this portfolio in the sector?

I don’t know if I’m hoping for anything from you. But a little bit of knowledge and expertise, and enthusiasm for the arts, wouldn’t have gone amiss.

Yeah, and as I said, I’m starting out learning more about the sector. I haven’t got deeply into it.

You’ve spoken to an actor and a couple of other people.

As you’ll be aware, I’ve got a number of other portfolio responsibilities.

There’s really not much more to ask you, is there? I mean, you just don’t know your subject.

Well, that’s right. But as I said, I’m starting to speak to people in the sector. I want to learn more. I don’t think I’m not enthusiastic, Steve, but, you know, it’s going to take time for me to immerse myself in the sector and the issues that are important to them.

I don’t know if anyone in the literary sector will respect you after your remarks about Tusiata Avia. Basically you were punching down.

I wouldn’t say that at all. You know, I was very clear that she had the right to say what she wanted. It’s just whether taxpayers should be supporting her work.

Do you see a sort of dissonance between Act’s advocacy of free speech and you cracking down on a Christchurch writer for writing things you don’t like?

No, I don’t at all. I was very clear in my comments that she had the right to say those things. But it’s just whether, you know, the New Zealand taxpayer should be giving her, you know, a grant of money.

You described her poem as “a hateful diatribe”. And Creative New Zealand ought not to have awarded her the Prime Minister’s Award, is that what you think?

Correct.

Who do you approve of that they should have given it to?

We wouldn’t have the government funding the arts in the way it is today. We want individuals that value and purchase and support the arts that they are of interest to them.

So, the Prime Minister’s Award, an annual award going back for a good 20 years or so [it was established in 2003], which hands out $60,000, to a practitioner of fiction, nonfiction and poetry, do you think that has a future?

Well, I’m not the Minister of Arts. You need to speak to him about that.

What do you think, Todd?

I’ve been very clear about what Act’s position is.

What’s your position? Can you reiterate it in this particular example?

Well, our position is that the government shouldn’t be supporting the arts in the way it does today. And we would give back more money to people so they can actually value things that they find creative and invest in and purchase them and attend them.

That way lies philistinism. Nothing would be made apart from maybe a few individuals who have an interest in, oh, I don’t know, musicals.

Well, I disagree.

I have absolutely no more questions for somebody who has absolutely no knowledge of their subject. But I appreciate your time.

Yeah, and as I said, Steve, I’m out there trying to learn more, and as I go through the rest of the year, I’m sure I will learn more. My door is always open to talk to people. That’s one thing you’ll find about me. In all the portfolios I’m engaged in, my door is always open to talk to stakeholders.

I think there would be very few people in the arts and literature who could be bothered opening the door to talk to you, Todd.

That’s your opinion, Steve. As I said, I’ve actually had some very fruitful engagements so far, and I’m looking forward to continuing that, and talking to more people in the year.

You’ve spoken to an actor and a couple of other people.

Yeah, as I said, I’m working through learning more about the portfolio.

All right. Thanks for your time.

Maybe I’ll talk to you later in the year, Steve.

I don’t see why. Bye.